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| 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternatives? https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=33175 |
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| Author: | Bobobo [ 15 Jul 2018, 03:36 ] |
| Post subject: | 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternatives? |
How do 1 ply hinoki jpen blades compare to multi ply hinoki jpen blades? Do other wood/composite materials pair well with hinoki? What alternative are there for hinoki both for 1 ply? How about for multi ply blades? What rubbers pair well with 1 ply hinoki jpen blades? |
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| Author: | rokphish2 [ 15 Jul 2018, 10:48 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternativ |
Vast different between 1 ply hinoki vs multi. For me, med-hard/hard rubbers pair well with 1 ply hinoki as the soft rubbers feel too soft/mushy with 1 ply hinoki. Unless you like it that way. I'm not saying multi ply hinoki is bad, just very different feeling vs 1 ply hinoki. Broadly it's like 1 ply hinoki vs regular blade. Thus more applicable rubbers for multi ply hinoki. Try to opt for thicker hinoki top ply if going with multi ply hinoki. instagram: rokphishtt |
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| Author: | adyy [ 04 Apr 2019, 01:41 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternativ |
As wood alternatives to Hinoki: spruce, fir, cedar, cypress, pine, spruce beeing the most elastic of the above group. |
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| Author: | iskandar taib [ 04 Apr 2019, 02:51 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternativ |
Note these are all softwoods/conifers (as is hinoki, which is also known as Japanese cypress). Proper 1 ply blades of this type use quarter-sawn wood, with the growth rings perpendicular to the blade surface. This is why 1 ply hinoki blades are so expensive - most of the log can't be used. This is also why blades like this are prone to splitting. Quarter sawn wood is immune to warping when shrinkage occurs, but I suspect the grain direction also influences how the blade vibrates. So if you want to make a blade out of one of the other woods, you'd need to haunt sawmills and select the wood - you want clear, knot-free, close-grained quarter-sawn blanks, and then you'll need to season them properly (and lose quite a bit of it to cracking and shrinkage). FF to 1:46. There was a company called "American Hinoki" making one ply blades out of American softwoods. Don't know if they're still in operation. There's this misconception that hinoki is a rare and expensive wood in Japan. It is not. There are huge forests that were planted just after WW2, and is (along with Japanese cedar - sugi) the main cause of hay fever in Japan. So much so that the current mayor of Tokyo has suggested cutting down most of the hinoki and sugi trees around Tokyo and replacing them with something else. Old growth Kiso hinoki is rare however. Iskandar |
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| Author: | adyy [ 04 Apr 2019, 05:18 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternativ |
These weeks I have found a veneer supplier in Japan that can sell hinoki, properly quarter sawn. They have a few thickness-es available and they told me they are a supplier for the TT industry as well. But not only. And they can sell small quantities, but the price is ... $$$$$ I wonder if a small pack would worth the money. As I have taken a look into their veneer catalog I have seen that they have 3 qualities available at totally different prices, the Kiso being the highest $$$$$. They explained me that the quality-levels are given by the origin of the wood. Kiso, is coming from a northern region of Japan where the climate is much better for this species. There the trees grow very slowly but they get taller and with very-very straight fibers. The other two are southern regions, where the climate is hotter and more humid, this making the wood to grow much-much faster but with the wood fibers being curled or even twisted. On the other hand ... I start to be curious about 1-ply blades. I will try to find some spruce around and cut it in 8-10mm sheets and (try to) craft a few blades. Just to see how a non-laminated blade can be. |
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| Author: | iskandar taib [ 05 Apr 2019, 02:48 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 1 ply hinoki play vs multi ply hinoki? Hinoki alternativ |
Ooh.. nice find. I own several 7 ply hinoki blades - three Yinhe Kiso 7s, a Darker 7p-2a and a Nittaku Septear. Even for the multi-ply blades they use quarter-sawn wood. I should bring them out again - the Kiso 7 had the nicest feel but it was a mite heavy. Maybe I should try different rubbers on them. The Darker was actually quite light, but I thought at the time it was a mite slow, so was the Septear. But I've since switched to the M8, which is also slower than what I was using at the time so perhaps perceptions might have changed. My game certainly has since that time. By the way, a lot of hinoki blades come out of Taiwan. The Yinhe blades do, so do other similar blades sold by other companies in the past (in turns out, including Butterfly). There's a Taiwanese table tennis vendor online which specializes in Japanese penhold and hinoki blades, and the prices aren't bad. Interesting also that hinoki (shakehands) blades typically have plain hinoki handles (though the Septear doesn't). Maybe it's for the pleasant smell. As for woods for 1 ply blades - I'm wondering if that aromatic cedar they use for cigar boxes might be just the thing. Problem would be getting the quarter-sawn blanks of course... I HAVE seen blanks on sale online, and veneers. I've also seen Sitka spruce blanks on ebay - the ones they use for music instrument soundboards are quarter-sawn, by the way, so there's a fair amount of it around. Iskandar |
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