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Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/attack
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=21956		 Page 62 of 82
Author:  Def-attack [ 13 Feb 2018, 20:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
dunc wrote:
Def-attack wrote:
This is pretty much how I want to use my BH (but it looks like he uses it without sponge):
http://youtu.be/sBHF7NT639Q

the way he uses that.. you may as well use something like Dr Evil SPs?


Might be (I have been thinking about it). But I want sponge, and Dr Evil is no good with sponge. Also, I think Hellcat or Aggressor makes the ball dive more than Dr Evil.
Author:  dunc [ 13 Feb 2018, 21:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
Why do you need sponge? I understand it on LPs (I physically can't play OX), but on SPs you might find it a little bit easier?
Author:  Def-attack [ 14 Feb 2018, 00:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
dunc wrote:
Why do you need sponge? I understand it on LPs (I physically can't play OX), but on SPs you might find it a little bit easier?


Yes, that might be, I have never considered it, nor tried it.
Author:  Japsican [ 14 Feb 2018, 03:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
yes, that is why I brought up OX earlier...because both WRM videos DA referenced were users using OX; one Hellcat and one Dawei 388-C1.

At least, I think the Dawei was OX. Hellcat was for sure, as he mentions it.
Author:  Def-attack [ 14 Feb 2018, 03:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
Japsican wrote:
yes, that is why I brought up OX earlier...because both WRM videos DA referenced were users using OX; one Hellcat and one Dawei 388-C1.

At least, I think the Dawei was OX. Hellcat was for sure, as he mentions it.

Yes, hellcat was in ox, don’t think the Dawei was though...
Off to training, too bad my Hellcat hasn’t arrived... will try Aggressor and GD 8228A
Author:  Japsican [ 14 Feb 2018, 03:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
Yesterday, I put Pluto in 1.5mm, on my viscaria and also my Xiom Offensive S. Was quite nice on both. I think I preferred the weight of the Viscaria, slightly lighter for some reason. But just slightly.

I'm still trying to decide if I want to try using it on the FH or BH. BH hand is so natural for me. I had every stroke already, borrowed from LPs, but with the addition of SP strokes (Hitting/Driving/blocking vs. top). Played a lot like Hellcat looks in that video.
Author:  Def-attack [ 14 Feb 2018, 07:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
Tonight I had a session with 1,5 mm Aggressor, first on Stiga Clipper (high throw) and then on my spare Carbonado 190 blade. The last one was good but I think a 1,3 mm would be better. He is dificult to tame but boy do you get rewarded! Lots o nasty low balls ans odd curves, and many in high speed.

I will need some practice and compare with my soon to be arrived Hellcat. Then I know if I should go all in with MP or if the bew anti Reflection seems interesting enough to keep me at that place.

But tomorrow, a small competition where I will enter with my son. I might go with Aggressor then, after just 2 hrs of practice... :o)
Author:  maddrag [ 14 Feb 2018, 13:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
hi, nice to talk to you again. As you know, just few months ago I started to use agressor 1.3 mm . I wanted a good mix of LP and SP carateristic and think I found it. ( you can read my beginning on agressor topic.) This is the rubber for the new ball.

I'm now starting to have a really good time. As you said, being able to have disturbance, control good attack and speed seems to be impossible to put on a same rubber but agressor is doing all that for me.

It is really like a TSP PR-1 and spectol put together. The pips are 1.70 of lenght and 2.1 mm of diameter. the sponge is said to be like an anti. The physics of it is that the lenght of the pips create a lot of disturbance, can trap the ball to slow it very considerably, do wonderfull chop with a lot of US or sidespin. Can do chop block against fast serve or very spinny, slow loop. The control of returning serve is very easy.

The size of the pips ( 2.1 mm) give the property of the sp. flat hit or counter hit can be done with a bit of practice for the right angle. Just blocking will give a dead ball. The size of the pips and its lenght just absorb the speed and spin of the new ball. never hit the bottom of the blade unless i hit it hard.

This a great tool to destabilised your opponent with fast and slow ball, no spin, reversal, fast flat hit.

Yesterday I play with a 2000 Canadian ranking guy who was fast looping to me. I start blocking his loops and then placed it. Depending if I lightly block ( ball doesn't go into the pips, just hit the top nub) or strongly block with more closed bat angle. ( ball goes into the pips) The result was a slow ball with US or a very low fast ball with no rotation. After 2 hrs I was also to block ball from middle distance. The block is making easier as it has a lot of distance between the pips. ) similar to TSP pr3 alpha.

Funny enough the pips become really more alive with strong shot from the opponant that are really come into the pips. At slow speed and low spin the pips are so bigs that it feel more like an sp unless you do some acceleration when you hit the ball.

A very nice shot is to practice a regular backhand with some angle and with the ball getting into the pips and then do one shot flat it. The ball suddenly become a shorter death ball. It is often an automatic win with the opponnant sending the ball in the net as it changed his stroke. The difference betwwen the 2 shots are just few degree of the bat angle.

Bump against Chop, push, service are often easy win. Very low, death of fast depending of the speed and underspin of the oponent and that skid often on the table. underspin serves.

Very good looper third ball attacker are used to do short underspin serves so they prepare for the third ball attack. I bump all of them almost and it become really difficult to return these low bump. So they stop doing it but it change their usual way of playing.

This is wonderfull ruber to tame. If you can really play all the possible shot that this ruber is offering you will start to create nightmare to the oponnent.

hit with a bat angle mean more LP shot. Flat bat mean more sp.

Did I mentionne that I can create different serve depending of the angle. Fast slow, side US etc. Always one of them that the opponent doen't like ....

Enough data, If you have question i can try to give you the answer.
Author:  maddrag [ 14 Feb 2018, 13:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
def-attack what is your difficulties if I can help you ?
Author:  Def-attack [ 14 Feb 2018, 15:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
maddrag wrote:
def-attack what is your difficulties if I can help you ?


Not sure yet, need to play more. I have been reading your experiences with Aggressor. And I am familiar with most of what you described above. Except for ”bump”, what do you mean with that? Fast, short movemnt straight towards the ball with open bat?

I find it crucial not to stand a bit further away from the table compared to when using anti. Also, keeping a low position and, of course, hiting the ball in front of you, is important (that means always be in the right position or you will be punished).
Author:  peterpong [ 14 Feb 2018, 19:02 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at

looks good.
Author:  Dusty054 [ 14 Feb 2018, 19:34 ]
Post subject:  Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/attack
Armstrong Attack 8 (MP) is available in a myriad of sponge thicknesses and hardnesses. Maybe there’s a combination you’d like. Got some for my dad in 41 degrees, 1.3mm & he really likes it. Not particularly fast, good control. Blocks, chops & hits (flatly) well. Not much grip, if that’s what you’re looking for.
Author:  Def-attack [ 15 Feb 2018, 00:02 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
Dusty054 wrote:
Armstrong Attack 8 (MP) is available in a myriad of sponge thicknesses and hardnesses. Maybe there’s a combination you’d like. Got some for my dad in 41 degrees, 1.3mm & he really likes it. Not particularly fast, good control. Blocks, chops & hits (flatly) well. Not much grip, if that’s what you’re looking for.


I’m gonna have to chose a rubber I can buy without much troubles. That disqualifies Armstrong. Hellcat and Aggressor are the ones I will start with.
Author:  111Iceman111 [ 15 Feb 2018, 00:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
@maddrag that is one of the best rubber analysis that i read in long time...it makes me to try it too:)
Author:  maddrag [ 15 Feb 2018, 00:57 ]
Post subject:  Re: Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/at
for the bump look at Jian Li. They are plenty of video. Almost a new one each month. He's playing with the LP Cloud and FOG 3 OX. I played that Lp with a .5 rubber and the agressor is doing better bump with more rapidity and lower bounce.

opponant who doesn't know him serves a short backspin and he bump them very often.

What is very interesting is getting a few push exchange and bump hard. It create a lot of confusion to the opponant. I'm not talking also about chopper who chop one of your top spin and then you bump his next chop so easily at the speed you want with great direction and control. also very difficult to chop back. WOW !!!

Yes it is more of a flat hit but depending where it fall on the table you will find that you need to change the orientation of the bat. Low ball = equal a hit with top blade toward the table ( upside down.) For fast ball nedium height I used a rapid flat hit with the top blade toward the side wall. I can hit high ball also with a flat hit or reverse flat hit that give a ball that dropping very short on the table.

Jian Li used it with the top blade toward the ceiling. For me it it more difficult and feel the hit less stronger.
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