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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:02 
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Wis wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:

Elbow position (aka arm structure) does go hand-in-hand with LTT120. It's a very clever observation. As the body tilts and moves, the arm structure should go with it. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots.


Hello, new member here :)

I'm curious when you talk about 'shoulder is the moving joint'. Because on TTedge you often talk about the body movement / weight transfer but not so much about the acceleration. With the forehand how are we suppose to do the acceleration ? With the backhand i (try to) do it with pressing my fingers at contact but it's not really natural to me with the forehand.

So should i use the fingers to 'activate' the acceleration ? And then the main accelerating part come from the shoulder or the elbow ? Thanks a lot :)


Welcome Wis!

I wrote "As the body tilts and moves, the arm structure should go with it. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots"... that's all pretty hard to visualize.

I've only really understood it for a couple of years, which is approximately 38 years too late. I didn't really expect everyone to understand what it meant and I intend to make a video about it. I've sort of mentioned it occasionally though it's never been clear.

In relation to acceleration, I'm not sure if there is such a thing. This comment should start a 10 page argument, and that's okay...I'm ready for it. Can a player use his fingers to hit the ball harder? Can I lift a fridge with my pinky finger?

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:05 
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wilkinru wrote:
Wis wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:

Elbow position (aka arm structure) does go hand-in-hand with LTT120. It's a very clever observation. As the body tilts and moves, the arm structure should go with it. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots.


Hello, new member here :)

I'm curious when you talk about 'shoulder is the moving joint'. Because on TTedge you often talk about the body movement / weight transfer but not so much about the acceleration. With the forehand how are we suppose to do the acceleration ? With the backhand i (try to) do it with pressing my fingers at contact but it's not really natural to me with the forehand.

So should i use the fingers to 'activate' the acceleration ? And then the main accelerating part come from the shoulder or the elbow ? Thanks a lot :)


Hi and welcome! I don't recall any talk of weight transfer on ttedge. I don't believe there is any acceleration either. There is just the whip action that is created from the body movement which will be faster or slower depending on a ton of factors, mostly being your physical ability. Also no talk about fingers. It's just a whip action like the bear shows. It's best with ttedge to forget what you have learned and I'm sure there is a Star Wars quote in there. :topspin:


I read this post after I wrote my last one. Russ, you understand what I understand, right or wrong. Perhaps we will go to hell together or maybe I'll get you a job coaching a top 10 world-ranked team.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:10 
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wilkinru wrote:
Hi and welcome! I don't recall any talk of weight transfer on ttedge. I don't believe there is any acceleration either. There is just the whip action that is created from the body movement which will be faster or slower depending on a ton of factors, mostly being your physical ability. Also no talk about fingers. It's just a whip action like the bear shows. It's best with ttedge to forget what you have learned and I'm sure there is a Star Wars quote in there. :topspin:

Use the whip, Luke! (c) SW


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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:25 
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ziv wrote:
Use the whip, Luke!


Igor, I still have footage of Laj grabbing and tilting you side to side to make a windmill. If I'm ever feeling down, I think I'll dig it up and publish that footage somewhere.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:28 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
ziv wrote:
Use the whip, Luke!

Igor, I still have footage of Laj grabbing and tilting you side to side to make a windmill. If I'm ever feeling down, I think I'll dig it up and publish that footage somewhere.

Are you trying to blackmail me, Brett?


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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 01:32 
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ziv wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
ziv wrote:
Use the whip, Luke!

Igor, I still have footage of Laj grabbing and tilting you side to side to make a windmill. If I'm ever feeling down, I think I'll dig it up and publish that footage somewhere.

Are you trying to blackmail me, Brett?


Not exactly, but I reserve the right, now that you mentioned it.

I watched it recently and it made me laugh out loud. I will bring it out when life is getting the better of me.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 02:00 
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Brett Clarke wrote:

I read this post after I wrote my last one. Russ, you understand what I understand, right or wrong. Perhaps we will go to hell together or maybe I'll get you a job coaching a top 10 world-ranked team.


Are they possibly the same thing? Both sound pretty interesting to me.

I'm currently deep into coaching older players. It's pretty neat to get an older player to do just a little bit more body and get a big change in stroke quality. I fixed this kid's forehand at the legs and he now has a better one than mine. Took 20 minutes maybe. The money is in coaching the old guys!


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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 02:03 
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wilkinru wrote:
Is there something to this falling back against super heavy spin? Is he trying to make sure he brushes the back of the ball (or even under it)?


Image

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Last edited by fastmover on 03 Oct 2019, 03:20, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 02:05 
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wilkinru wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:

I read this post after I wrote my last one. Russ, you understand what I understand, right or wrong. Perhaps we will go to hell together or maybe I'll get you a job coaching a top 10 world-ranked team.


Are they possibly the same thing? Both sound pretty interesting to me.


Not really. One makes you very hot and the other makes you very dizzy.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:09 
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wilkinru wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
wilkinru wrote:
https://youtu.be/1ImOd6ah1HY?t=170

I'm watching this point and thinking to myself "man this is going to be good instruction on how to loop chops" and then I see Kanak just about falling over in nearly 5 shots in a row. The first 2 I feel like he got jammed but even the 3rd loop he falls back and he was not jammed one bit. Watch it at 25% speed and notice his complete lack of balance on contact.

Is there something to this falling back against super heavy spin? Is he trying to make sure he brushes the back of the ball (or even under it)?


It's not as bad as it looks in this exact context. Imagine that you want to hit the ball with topspin and your target is the roof 20 feet in front of you. What would you do?

The torso needs to be tilted back to get maximum lift. If you lean back enough, your left leg will have to stop you from falling over. A torso that is twisting on a backward angle needs support and that's the left leg going behind you. He's not stepping back per se...his left leg is stopping him from falling over because of the extreme angle of the spinning torso.


This is very interesting stuff. I'll have to do some experiments (looping into the second story of my house...). At first I thought I saw a clear technical issue but one has to keep in mind Kanak pretty much makes a living looping backspin. He might know something I don't. This will change my perspective on looping backspin.


Strokes are circular. You have to realize that with maximum power, especially using the lower body, if something is coming forward, something needs to be going backward. If Kanak was physically stronger the effect might not be as obvious.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:10 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
Wis wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:

Elbow position (aka arm structure) does go hand-in-hand with LTT120. It's a very clever observation. As the body tilts and moves, the arm structure should go with it. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots.


Hello, new member here :)

I'm curious when you talk about 'shoulder is the moving joint'. Because on TTedge you often talk about the body movement / weight transfer but not so much about the acceleration. With the forehand how are we suppose to do the acceleration ? With the backhand i (try to) do it with pressing my fingers at contact but it's not really natural to me with the forehand.

So should i use the fingers to 'activate' the acceleration ? And then the main accelerating part come from the shoulder or the elbow ? Thanks a lot :)


Welcome Wis!

I wrote "As the body tilts and moves, the arm structure should go with it. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots. The shoulder is the moving joint that gives extra whip and power to shots"... that's all pretty hard to visualize.

I've only really understood it for a couple of years, which is approximately 38 years too late. I didn't really expect everyone to understand what it meant and I intend to make a video about it. I've sort of mentioned it occasionally though it's never been clear.

In relation to acceleration, I'm not sure if there is such a thing. This comment should start a 10 page argument, and that's okay...I'm ready for it. Can a player use his fingers to hit the ball harder? Can I lift a fridge with my pinky finger?


The lord of whip says acceleration doesn't exist?

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:14 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
ziv wrote:
Use the whip, Luke!


Igor, I still have footage of Laj grabbing and tilting you side to side to make a windmill. If I'm ever feeling down, I think I'll dig it up and publish that footage somewhere.


I remember that vividly. I shudder when I think of what it would look like on camera

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:17 
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fastmover wrote:
wilkinru wrote:
Is there something to this falling back against super heavy spin? Is he trying to make sure he brushes the back of the ball (or even under it)?


Loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
ooooooooooooooooooooooooool



Please fix your formatting.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:21 
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wilkinru wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:

I read this post after I wrote my last one. Russ, you understand what I understand, right or wrong. Perhaps we will go to hell together or maybe I'll get you a job coaching a top 10 world-ranked team.


Are they possibly the same thing? Both sound pretty interesting to me.

I'm currently deep into coaching older players. It's pretty neat to get an older player to do just a little bit more body and get a big change in stroke quality. I fixed this kid's forehand at the legs and he now has a better one than mine. Took 20 minutes maybe. The money is in coaching the old guys!


Kids can sometimes take the fun out of coaching. My kid student is decently adjusting for backspin while barely practicing once a week. If an adult did that it would be a miracle.

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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2019, 03:21 
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NextLevel wrote:


Please fix your formatting.


Done :)

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