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Harimoto defeats Ma Long! https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=33082	Page 2 of 4

Author:	iskandar taib [ 14 Jun 2018, 02:01 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
That's where I differ with a lot of people here. Bad character??? Where?? Disrespect?? I don't think he's disrespectful at all. He does cho loudly when he wins a point, but he doesn't throw tantrums, he doesn't yell at people, he doesn't argue with the umpire, he doesn't show attitude, he doesn't get in peoples' faces, he shakes hands with everyone after the match. You hardly hear a peep from him when he's on a losing streak (watch the fourth and fifth games vs. Ma Long). I've seen and heard far worse... anyone who's ever witnessed Tim Boggan's antics when he's losing would know what I mean, for instance (imagine a 60+ year old man with long white hair screaming and cursing up and down the court, until a 12 year old boy in the adjacent court shouts for everyone to stop until he calms down.. and eventually when he does, the kid yells "Thank You!"... ). Iskandar

Author:	benc6190 [ 14 Jun 2018, 12:56 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
I agree the celebrating every point won feels excessive but It's just a part of keeping momentum, not bad character. Table tennis points go by super fast as do the games so its important to keep your head in the game. It may negatively effect opponents but that is part of the "mental" game.

Author:	iskandar taib [ 18 Jun 2018, 13:48 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
Since Japan Open finals matches are being mentioned, here's Ito vs. Wang.. Harimoto's game does look similar in some ways to Ito's - close to the table, fantastic blocking and angles. The womens' game is slower, of course.. those bananas and "strawberries" are pretty effective when they work. 1:02 and 1:24.. which seems to be an extreme chicken-wing banana... Iskandar

Author:	Japsican [ 18 Jun 2018, 23:03 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
I truly admire this kid's play, and I like him as a person. Very humble and respectful off the court. And I'm sure there is no intended ill-will towards people. But if you watch the NBA for example, you've seen when a guy dunks on another guy how they yell and scream because it was such a "in your face" moment. Now, imagine if basketball players screamed on EVERY POINT MADE like midrange jumpers or routine layups, and NOT only after emphatic dunks or particularly good plays like pass/lob or 3 point shots at the buzzer. It would be obnoxious, and in fact they'd probably receive a technical for it. I think that's how most people see Tomo's choing...as over doing it. He chos on 97% of all points made, and most are not particularly noteworthy.

Author:	Japsican [ 19 Jun 2018, 00:40 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
And what some see as "disrespectful" is not the choing itself, but the frequency and intensity with which he chos. It's not like points are seldom had in TT. Not like a touchdown in American Football, or a Goal in Football (soccer) or a goal in hockey. Each one of those scores is worthy of celebration because a lot went in to getting that one point. But points are so frequently acquired in TT, choing loudly and emphatically on every single point, and even rather pedestrian points is over-doing it, and perceived as disrespectful. Again, I don't think he intends disrespect.

Author:	AsylumKing [ 19 Jun 2018, 04:43 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
benc6190 wrote: I agree the celebrating every point won feels excessive but It's just a part of keeping momentum, not bad character. Table tennis points go by super fast as do the games so its important to keep your head in the game. It may negatively effect opponents but that is part of the "mental" game. Have watched an interview of his. Comes across as a pretty quiet and humble guy. So due cred to his skill and the hardwork he's put in to reach this level at this age. Like you mentioned it's a part of the mental game and pro or not im sure that kind of loud Cho'ing could unsettle someone. Personally not one for it, imagine everyone starts getting in on this loud Cho'ing competition.

Author:	iskandar taib [ 11 Jul 2018, 14:42 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
I don't see him choing excessively here. Loud, yes, but Ovtcharov chos just as often. He also does NOT cho when he hits an edge, like everyone else he puts his hand up. I also don't see him playing close to the table more than Ovtcharov does. He does step back occasionally and spin the ball hard. He also spins the ball quite a bit when he hits the ball early, though he does block a lot. This is also some of the best table tennis I've watched in a while. Iskandar

Author:	mynamenotbob [ 11 Jul 2018, 16:38 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!

Author:	iskandar taib [ 11 Jul 2018, 20:12 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
He doesn't bend back enough... And I think the "Cho" comes from Chinese (for "ball"). But other than that, I AGREE WITH HIM 100%!! French!?? Iskandar

Author:	iskandar taib [ 14 Jul 2018, 01:55 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
Speaking of Dima - what is it that he yells when he chos? It sounds like "Stoik" to me. Iskandar

Author:	Japsican [ 14 Jul 2018, 02:32 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
Again, it's the frequency. Sure he doesn't cho on edges and nets. But again, as I said above, he chose on almost all other points won, even unimpressive ones. Contrary to that comment on the Dima video. Would you feel like it was okay to watch in a basketball game on 96% of all buckets scored like routine jumpers? It would be ob-nox-ious. Still, I don't think it's intentionally disrespectful, but if people think it is...it is. It's like the other day a guy referred to me as "oriental." You all know that's not the correct nomenclature for a person of Asian descent. It's like referring to a person of African descent as "colored." I think the person intended no ill-will towards me, and personally I don't care if someone refers to me as oriental, but many would be offended by it. This guy was from the south, in the country, probably just didn't know any better. Or, it's like an American guest pouring soy sauce on a home cooked Japanese meal...unintentionally rude, but still rude nonetheless. I think that's what's going on here with Harimoto. Just doesn't know any better and/or there are cultural differences. That's why I am more a fan of him than not.

Author:	sderyke2002 [ 14 Jul 2018, 02:49 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
His cho'ing doesn't bother me. But then I don't mind the grunts on every shot some tennis players do. It is meant for focus I suspect much like a Kai when throwing a punch in Karate even if the punch doesn't land. I have the habit of talking to myself after a missed shot saying out loud what I did wrong. It probably doesn't work (I still am not very good) but the point is some people think I am making excuses and take it as a slight to their good shot. I don't mean it like that but they hear it enough and are insecure enough that it bothers them. I explain if I am asked or if they complain but I don't see any reason to stop. The mental aspect is part of the game, perhaps even a large part since many tricky serves are used just for the surprise effect. In chess when they used to allow smoking in tournaments I remember a guy who smoked long thin cigars and would never knock off the ash, so he could get 4 inches of it hanging from the end, hoping you would get focused on when it would fall off on its own. That to me was much worse than what Harimoto does.

Author:	hleett [ 15 Jul 2018, 08:58 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
.

Author:	hleett [ 15 Jul 2018, 09:01 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
mattfisher wrote: iskandar taib wrote: Oh? How do you figure that one out? Iskandar Right?! Like obviously if you play disrespectfully and cho then many many people are gonna go hate you for it I think this is one of the main differences between why people respect mima ito but hate harimoto Mima Ito is talent highlighted by talent Harimoto is talent highlighted by his bad character I totally agree !!!

Author:	iskandar taib [ 15 Jul 2018, 13:37 ]
Post subject:	Re: Harimoto defeats Ma Long!
Japsican wrote: Still, I don't think it's intentionally disrespectful, but if people think it is...it is. Really??? Oh come on. If (some) people think it is, all you can really say is that (some) people think it is. Iskandar

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