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PostPosted: 17 Jun 2021, 19:00 
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Hello,

i am new here. I am 36 years old and i have been playing table tennis all my childhood long. In the last 10 years i have been switching more to tennis but i cant stand it anymore as injuries come and I feel like a heavy stone after each match.
I want to get into table tennis again..its just a more "finesse" and quick sport for me. all this bags dragging and searching for a hitting partner and driving to the place can be really exhausting if you are a fresh father :)

so.. I consider myself a good intermediate and I have some year of penholding after me - I started as a shakehander but i will never go back to shakehand.

My game is mostly looping with forehand and a Ma Lin inspired reverse backhand. However I wish a little more control and maybe less speed as I am not Ma Lin.

I have been thinking about the Ma Lin Carbon paddle,but is this maybe too advanced for me? like i said, i am done with basics and i can hit a pretty decent reverse backhand.

What to choose? price does not mather for now, but a price around 100 euro for a complete setup is good.

Are there also some complete premade racquets for this style? i am maybe all+ or off- player.
Maybe Killeerspin jer 600?

thanks for all that wish to help and cheers :)


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PostPosted: 17 Jun 2021, 22:55 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
I really enjoy DHS Hurricane Hao 2. It’s a bit out of your budget, but maybe you can find it second hand on the forums here or at my table tennis. I was able to pick up two for $100.

Previous to using that, I used Nittaku Acoustic and Yasaka Sweden Classic. I really prefer the HH2 and the BH feel is excellent.

If budget is an issue I would consider the Ma Lin Extra Offensive or Yasaka Sweden Extra. The latter has excellent feel!

Sorry, I can’t comment on the Ma Lin carbon. I’ve never tried it.
I would not recommend a premade.

What rubbers are you thinking? That might help narrow down your search to be closer to your budget.


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PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 01:00 
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I'd suggest the Sanwei M8:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002357358032.html

Or try this one if you can't bother with ordering stuff from China.

https://www.zeropong.com/gambler-penhol ... hold-p-539

The Sanwei blade would be lighter, if you want to play RPB (with two rubber sheets).

Iskandar


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PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 01:41 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
One other blade I felt was pretty good on the less expensive side was a Yinhe U3. Basically a Clipper clone (7 ply all wood limba/ayous combo).

Hurricane 3 pairs well.


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 Post subject: Re: C-pen blade for an
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 03:02 
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Alas wrote:
I really enjoy DHS Hurricane Hao 2. It’s a bit out of your budget, but maybe you can find it second hand on the forums here or at my table tennis. I was able to pick up two for $100.

Previous to using that, I used Nittaku Acoustic and Yasaka Sweden Classic. I really prefer the HH2 and the BH feel is excellent.

If budget is an issue I would consider the Ma Lin Extra Offensive or Yasaka Sweden Extra. The latter has excellent feel!

Sorry, I can’t comment on the Ma Lin carbon. I’ve never tried it.
I would not recommend a premade.

What rubbers are you thinking? That might help narrow down your search to be closer to your budget.


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thanks for the detailed answer. I dont know about rubbers - I always played with butterfly Sriver.

one guy wrote:

I have previously used darker speed 90 penhold and move to Yeo for RPB. I have decided to purchase DHS hurricane after reading some review and also was hoping that the blade will be good for RPB. If you are thinking that please do not invest in hurricane hao. It is not worth the value and I am comparing directly with Yasaka Extra offensive blade. I have sticked yasaka 7 for both fh and bh. Hurricane Hao has no power for fh loop and it is definitely not spinner than yeo. For bh RPB, it is not comparable with Yeo. Yeo has more speed and power compare to hurricane hao. Hurricane hao seems to have a slightly higher throw than yeo but trade off is not worth it. Pls avoid this blade. When people say lack of power it really is. Worse than premade bat

I really dont want to get too much into this,i just want something for an allround game a little on the ofensive side.
which rubbers do you propose? some long lasting ones :D

what about premade racquets?


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PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 06:52 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
kajetan wrote:
Alas wrote:
I really enjoy DHS Hurricane Hao 2. It’s a bit out of your budget, but maybe you can find it second hand on the forums here or at my table tennis. I was able to pick up two for $100.

Previous to using that, I used Nittaku Acoustic and Yasaka Sweden Classic. I really prefer the HH2 and the BH feel is excellent.

If budget is an issue I would consider the Ma Lin Extra Offensive or Yasaka Sweden Extra. The latter has excellent feel!

Sorry, I can’t comment on the Ma Lin carbon. I’ve never tried it.
I would not recommend a premade.

What rubbers are you thinking? That might help narrow down your search to be closer to your budget.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


thanks for the detailed answer. I dont know about rubbers - I always played with butterfly Sriver.

one guy wrote:

I have previously used darker speed 90 penhold and move to Yeo for RPB. I have decided to purchase DHS hurricane after reading some review and also was hoping that the blade will be good for RPB. If you are thinking that please do not invest in hurricane hao. It is not worth the value and I am comparing directly with Yasaka Extra offensive blade. I have sticked yasaka 7 for both fh and bh. Hurricane Hao has no power for fh loop and it is definitely not spinner than yeo. For bh RPB, it is not comparable with Yeo. Yeo has more speed and power compare to hurricane hao. Hurricane hao seems to have a slightly higher throw than yeo but trade off is not worth it. Pls avoid this blade. When people say lack of power it really is. Worse than premade bat

I really dont want to get too much into this,i just want something for an allround game a little on the ofensive side.
which rubbers do you propose? some long lasting ones :D

what about premade racquets?
I think it’s really hard to read into everyone’s subjective feeling, so I can’t speak against what that person feels- so always take these reviews with a grain of salt.

I use H3 Neo Provincial (blue sponge) 39 deg 2.1 on FH and find it very adequate in the power department. It’s the most “penetrating” set up I’ve used. Granted I always use chinese rubber on FH (variant of Hurricane or skyline).

For BH I switch between Butterfly tenergy 64 or tenergy 05fx. 64 doesn’t last as long but has lots of speed with good feel and control in my opinion. For a longer lasting solution, I would look at Tibhar EL-P. It’s a little harder but has great control and enough speed and spin. Or you can try one of the Nittaku FastArc series.

If you want something that will last probably even longer and give you more spin and control, I recommend DHS skyline 3-60. Probably the slowest of what I’ve mentioned but extreme spin and control.

I believe driver still exists from butterfly, right? You could always just try that out on the blade you choose. Wang Hao used that rubber topsheet ;) …maybe it’s good enough for us mortals.

I have not used YEO extensively but I have compared back to back with H3 on FH. My opinion was the Hurricane Hao 2 had more power and spin. It feels so right in my hand. The YEO had Rakza 7 soft on the Bh which also wasn’t bad but I didn’t really evaluate it so I won’t speak on it. It was a very controlled set up in my opinion.

In the end- you can’t go wrong. Both blades were used professionally at levels higher than I can imagine for myself. You will figure out the nuances and train / practice to improve in those areas you need (speed, control, spin, tactics, etc…)


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PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 16:18 
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I recommend the YEO over the Ma Lin Carbon. The YEO gave me a better "feel" and more control, compared to the Ma Lin Carbon.


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 Post subject: Re: C-pen blade for an
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2021, 22:44 
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Alas wrote:
kajetan wrote:
Alas wrote:
I really enjoy DHS Hurricane Hao 2. It’s a bit out of your budget, but maybe you can find it second hand on the forums here or at my table tennis. I was able to pick up two for $100.

Previous to using that, I used Nittaku Acoustic and Yasaka Sweden Classic. I really prefer the HH2 and the BH feel is excellent.

If budget is an issue I would consider the Ma Lin Extra Offensive or Yasaka Sweden Extra. The latter has excellent feel!

Sorry, I can’t comment on the Ma Lin carbon. I’ve never tried it.
I would not recommend a premade.

What rubbers are you thinking? That might help narrow down your search to be closer to your budget.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


thanks for the detailed answer. I dont know about rubbers - I always played with butterfly Sriver.

one guy wrote:

I have previously used darker speed 90 penhold and move to Yeo for RPB. I have decided to purchase DHS hurricane after reading some review and also was hoping that the blade will be good for RPB. If you are thinking that please do not invest in hurricane hao. It is not worth the value and I am comparing directly with Yasaka Extra offensive blade. I have sticked yasaka 7 for both fh and bh. Hurricane Hao has no power for fh loop and it is definitely not spinner than yeo. For bh RPB, it is not comparable with Yeo. Yeo has more speed and power compare to hurricane hao. Hurricane hao seems to have a slightly higher throw than yeo but trade off is not worth it. Pls avoid this blade. When people say lack of power it really is. Worse than premade bat

I really dont want to get too much into this,i just want something for an allround game a little on the ofensive side.
which rubbers do you propose? some long lasting ones :D

what about premade racquets?
I think it’s really hard to read into everyone’s subjective feeling, so I can’t speak against what that person feels- so always take these reviews with a grain of salt.

I use H3 Neo Provincial (blue sponge) 39 deg 2.1 on FH and find it very adequate in the power department. It’s the most “penetrating” set up I’ve used. Granted I always use chinese rubber on FH (variant of Hurricane or skyline).

For BH I switch between Butterfly tenergy 64 or tenergy 05fx. 64 doesn’t last as long but has lots of speed with good feel and control in my opinion. For a longer lasting solution, I would look at Tibhar EL-P. It’s a little harder but has great control and enough speed and spin. Or you can try one of the Nittaku FastArc series.

If you want something that will last probably even longer and give you more spin and control, I recommend DHS skyline 3-60. Probably the slowest of what I’ve mentioned but extreme spin and control.

I believe driver still exists from butterfly, right? You could always just try that out on the blade you choose. Wang Hao used that rubber topsheet ;) …maybe it’s good enough for us mortals.

I have not used YEO extensively but I have compared back to back with H3 on FH. My opinion was the Hurricane Hao 2 had more power and spin. It feels so right in my hand. The YEO had Rakza 7 soft on the Bh which also wasn’t bad but I didn’t really evaluate it so I won’t speak on it. It was a very controlled set up in my opinion.

In the end- you can’t go wrong. Both blades were used professionally at levels higher than I can imagine for myself. You will figure out the nuances and train / practice to improve in those areas you need (speed, control, spin, tactics, etc…)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hello, you seem to know your gear very well so i will trust you. Can i ask whats the BH butterfly tenergy thickness on your backhand side? 1.8?2.0? you seem like a advanced player. I am only a good recreative player.my main question if this setup would be maybe overkill for my skills?or i can adapt to it and use it well if i train?i play 2-3x a week 1-2 hours. :)


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2021, 01:05 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
Thanks but I wouldn’t call myself an advanced player… just a very enthusiastic player.

I use 2.1 on the BH on those Tenergy rubbers.
In my opinion, you can train and adapt to any set up- but without coaching, you’ll surely develop some bad habits, so I really encourage a coach if you can afford it. Go with a cheaper set up to make that happen. Then, in the future- you can upgrade your gear. The fundamentals are key. The earlier, the better. Habits are very hard to break.

If you already have those fundamentals down, then you’ll be fine and you will adapt.

Tell me, what does it mean to be a recreational player for you? Will you participate in any leagues or tournaments? I also play only 2-3 times a week but that includes coaching, leagues and sometimes tournaments. In the end, it’s all enjoyable- and I know there’s no chance to become a professional!


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2021, 04:06 
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maybe I expressed myself wrongly. I think I am more a recreative player but I want to enter some LOW-mid level leagues in a few years. My philosophy is also, that it maybe would not make sense to start with some really cheap amateur blade and then switch, bettter I start with a quality blade from "ground up". I am not planning to join some advanced leagues, just a recreational league or at least some tournament - but also recreational players can be very good (mostly those who play a life long).

I just wanted to know if your setup is too "fast" for me, because I like to have some control? Its also true that you need some really fast blade for RPB :) the speed is always welcome, but you lose some control.

anyway: in short: i am probably a way more undeveloped player than you are :P but I am a fanatic when I start sometimes, just like with tennis - I could teach others to play correctly as I really studies mechanics so much :)

BTW, i have beeen a little away, what is with this cuted rubers to make room for fingers? I see some rubers are shorter on one side than on the other. Is this to make room for fingers? is this necessary? nothing is, i guess.

thanks for your help, i am really satisfied with your answers. there is hope for humanity! :P

for coaching: i dont think i will have it as in our region there are absolute no penhold players. my teachers are the video lessons and observing players like Ma lin and Wang Hao


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2021, 05:07 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
kajetan wrote:
maybe I expressed myself wrongly. I think I am more a recreative player but I want to enter some LOW-mid level leagues in a few years. My philosophy is also, that it maybe would not make sense to start with some really cheap amateur blade and then switch, bettter I start with a quality blade from "ground up". I am not planning to join some advanced leagues, just a recreational league or at least some tournament - but also recreational players can be very good (mostly those who play a life long).

I just wanted to know if your setup is too "fast" for me, because I like to have some control? Its also true that you need some really fast blade for RPB :) the speed is always welcome, but you lose some control.

anyway: in short: i am probably a way more undeveloped player than you are :P but I am a fanatic when I start sometimes, just like with tennis - I could teach others to play correctly as I really studies mechanics so much :)

BTW, i have beeen a little away, what is with this cuted rubers to make room for fingers? I see some rubers are shorter on one side than on the other. Is this to make room for fingers? is this necessary? nothing is, i guess.

thanks for your help, i am really satisfied with your answers. there is hope for humanity! :P

for coaching: i dont think i will have it as in our region there are absolute no penhold players. my teachers are the video lessons and observing players like Ma lin and Wang Hao


I always encourage to get the best blade you can afford and stick to it.

Regarding equipment speed and control- it’s hard for me to say. These are subjective things. I agree starting off with very fast rubbers might not be ideal, but if you have a coach or solid training partner, you could get through the steeper learning curve with sound fundamentals. Video yourself as often as possible and analyze your stroke mechanics. I feel a little bad encouraging someone to jump into the expensive world of Tenergy, but for me - Tenergy 64 on HH2 has great feel, control & speed if you have a smaller stroke. It’s got a dwelly feel but also has great speed. This means, my blocks can be utilized to add pressure on the opponent and I can comfortably attack from my Bh wing even at mid to far distances from the table. This is all from my own perspective and game.

I think you could start off with honestly any of the mentioned rubbers in this thread for your BH to establish your fundamentals and game. The cost and training aspect part is up to you to help decide which way you go. Just realize it takes time to get used to new things if and when you switch it up. Don’t expect too much out of yourself in the beginning.

Regarding rubber gap: typically used for making room for fingers and weight control. Depends on what you like. Some things you need to consider are the feel (wood vs. rubber), angle (with thumb on rubber, your natural angle and necessary pressures are slightly different) and your ideal weight.

Regarding coaching: my coach is a shakehander but still can convey fundamentals to me. I don’t think it heavily matters unless you need help with basic grip and RPB nuances. Give a reputable coach a chance. I picked my coach based off of their game as I wanted something similar for mine.


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2021, 06:49 
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Blade: Hinoki Carbon Off++ 9mm
FH: H3
BH: Moon Speed
kajetan wrote:
maybe I expressed myself wrongly. I think I am more a recreative player but I want to enter some LOW-mid level leagues in a few years.

Well then at the level you're describing sounds like you need a Sanwei M8 or equivalent. Maybe a Sanwei CC for the carbon equivalent if you feel like you really need it.
I'd suggest Clipper Wood if you want solid blocks along with Looping capability and less "vibration"
or Sanwei Fextra (warning, this blade is way faster than the Clipper) for a more affordable option.
Any all wood blade 5.8mm-7mm will do regardless of price or brand. Anything more than 7mm is too stiff, anything below 5.8mm wobbles if you don't have a firm grip.
I prefer 6.4 mm and up for solid blocks but that's just me.

kajetan wrote:
My philosophy is also, that it maybe would not make sense to start with some really cheap amateur blade and then switch, bettter I start with a quality blade from "ground up".

But you seem to have the wrong assumption about user-suggested All-Wood, Allround blades to be "really cheap amateur"
when these are blades that are good quality; a step up from what you'd find on Premade rackets/hobbybats and are going to last you a few years.
Xu Xin for the bulk of his career was using All+ to Off- All-Wood blades at most and wasn't until very recently when he decided to switch to Carbon.
Wang Hao, Ma Lin All-Wood blades for their entire careers.
Ding Ning, Liu Shiwen, Guo Yue, Guo Yan in the 2010s were using Stiga Energy Wood. A typical All+ allwood with nothing special about it.

Maybe if someone said "Korbel" or "Primorac" instead of "Sanwei M8" you'd consider them when the only difference is that the former blades are gonna put a larger dent on your wallet.

kajetan wrote:
Its also true that you need some really fast blade for RPB .

Not fast blade but fast rubber. Combine both fast blade and rubber and all your shots are gonna be very direct either going long or straight to the net if you don't have the right angle. Very little margin for error.
I've tried a 1 ply Hinoki (9mm thick) for RPB and had a hard time getting all balls on the table.


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2021, 19:50 
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Thanks to all, I think I will go with YEO.. Hurricane Hao 2 or 3 is a l little over my budget. Could anyone help me pick the rubbers as i will buy in this shop (im from europe) and all rubers talked about here are not available.

https://www.tt-shop.com/com_eng/table-t ... bbers.html

fh?bh (rpb)? the most i want to know which thickness i should pick :) i think something that has some "room for error" would be good for me, obviously i want the loop to land the balls safe in the field :) playstyle is all+ off- or something like this. i like to go under the ball too :)


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2021, 03:06 
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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao II
FH: DHS Hurricane III NEO Pro
BH: Nittaku FastArc-G1
I was once of the mindset that I could use the hardest and max thickness on both sides, but now a bit older and a little wiser, 2.1 is a sweet spot for me where I can get a bit more feel (especially on denser Chinese style rubbers).

I prefer softer rubber for my Bh to feel like I can grab, flick and really control my shots and blocks.

I think if you’re more on the offensive side, I wouldn’t recommend going under 2.0.


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2021, 03:56 
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Guys - all this talk about "amateur" and "professional" blades is, well..

Think about this a little. What's a "professional blade"? Something fast with carbon in it? And what's a professional? Any actual "professionals" on this forum? The only one I can think of who plays at that level is Brett (and there's also one of the players Brett coaches on the Indian team who showed up a while back). The rest of us are all "enthusiasts". We love to discuss and argue about equipment, which we all know something about, I suppose. You'll notice Brett almost NEVER does - he posts about technique instead.

What's a "good intermediate"? That could be anything from about USATT rating of 1400 (who'd whip ANY recreational player I've met 99 games out of 100) to someone rated in the 1900s (who'd win 99 out 100 games against the 1400 guy). Above that would be the really good tournament players, who are rated over 2000 (the 1900 player would lose 8 out of 10 games to someone rated over 2000). So as you can see, this is a HUGE RANGE of skill levels.

What I'm trying to get at is this - if you read the thousands of posts on this forum you'll see there's a consensus that fast carbon blades just aren't the thing for most of us. The usual recommendation is for a five ply all-wood blade - and there are a LOT of these, some are better than others, of course (DON'T get a Yinhe N6.. :lol: ). The better ones for most people who are rated under 2000, AND for many of those rated above, are blades rated ALL to OFF-. It's better that you learn proper strokes than have to pull your punches because you find most of your power shots missing the table. The reason I recommend the M8 is because I play with it. I've got 2-3 tote bags full of other blades (including some expensive seven ply hinoki blades) and the M8 has better feel and control than all of them, and it's plenty fast enough when I need the speed. The fact that you can get one for $8 is a bonus - get one (or two, or three), if you don't like it it's only $8 and no big deal, and you can pass it on to someone else. Who buys these ultra-fast carbon blades? I don't know, but I'll bet Butterfly sells a LOT of them anyhow.. :lol:

As an aside - I agree about the sponge. In the 1980s and 90s everyone was told to never play any sponge thicker than 2.0mm, and beginners should start with 1.5mm. These days a LOT of Chinese rubbers (especially the cheap ones aimed at beginners) are ONLY available with max sponge (i.e. 2.2mm or so). What's changed? The ball. In the 1990s the ball was 2mm smaller and quite a bit lighter. We've been through two ball changes since then - the larger ball is easier to control and you need the extra thickness to put enough spin on the new ball. Thin sponge is for specialist use - balsa blades, choppers, pips-out blockers... Most of us don't need it.

Iskandar


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