OOAK Table Tennis Forum

anyone knows anything besides what is posted on this page?
http://drneubauer.com/shop.php?cat=1&ca ... us&prod=91

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The Dark Side: "Quicker, easier, more seductive" - Yoda

We just got some sheets of Viper in the shop, and here is some more information:







Pimples do look slightly smaller, and seem to have low grip and they are soft and bend easily. Slow with a low trajectory would be ideal for close-in blocking/pushing.

Carsten kindly included a sample for forum testing, so would anyone like to give one a go and write a review?

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OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide

That information graphic is quite nice, all companies should provide that information. The rubber looks interesting, relatively thin pips close together is along the lines of palio ck531a perhaps. Would be nice to test.

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Competition bats:
Win-tec power def Tibhar 5Q sound Power Update 1.8 * Spinlord Agenda ox
TSP Balsa 3.5 Tibhar Genius+Optimium sound 1.8 * Grass D-tecs ox

Put to rest:
Galaxy T10 Bluefire M2 2.0 Palio Ck531a ox
Victas Koji Matsushita Tibhar Genius+Optimium sound MAX * Spinlord Dornenglanz ox
Donic Defplay Senso Tibhar Aurus Sound Black max * Grass D-tecs ox

Check out my quest for my new blade here: http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=23241
Current standings:
Butterfly Matshushita powerdefence * Joola Chen Weixing * Nittaku KVU * Nittaku Shake defense* Tibhar stratus power defense * Victas Koji Matsushita * Yasaka Sweeper * Win-Tec power defence

When I read the description, I immediately thought about PB.

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There's always stuff to improve!

My blog on being a LP defender beyond 2000 USATT and the pips discrimination that comes along with that

I would love to give it a go. If it is a red sheet, I'll tear off the Grass on my Smart blade and give it a try.

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The Dark Side: "Quicker, easier, more seductive" - Yoda

Dear Julien,
my honey Colleague.

Please take a while to read this ITTF instructive document, with all due carefullness. Circulate this to as many people as possible.

No rules amendment is needed, I declare. All we need is to learn and observe the ITTF specific instructions of the Match Officials Handbook (HMO), a great help for those umpires onduty.

[img]smileys/smiley38.gif"%20align="middle[/img]--All the Umpires, while onduty, should invariably obey the Golden Words prescription.
Umpire is stongly required to take a preventive action between rallies, to talk to the service offender informally in small, polite voice.

Yours respectfully

Igor NOVICK
national umpire
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Dear Julien,
Be so kind as to incorporate this Golden Words picture into your facebook site for everyone's open viewing.

Thanks.

Dear Igor,
my honey poster,

I want to thank you for your informative post about the topic above. If all posts would be like yours, forums would be a livable place.

Yours respectfully

Lorenzo Il Magnifico
fellow OOAK member


Yes.

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There's always stuff to improve!

My blog on being a LP defender beyond 2000 USATT and the pips discrimination that comes along with that

fazer227 Hi I also play with a Smart am interested in how you got on with the Viper. Have you a review on the rubber/blade combination yet?

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Setup 1: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS acid green OX BH
Setup 2: Setup 2: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango PS black 2.00mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS red OX BH
Setup 3: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Spinlord Gigant anti-spin red BH
See the ball, be the ball...

hm, didnt knew where to post, maybe moderator can join the new thread about viper golum started?

i have bought new sheet of viper, red ox, to try it on my blade, btty power defense...

coming from dornenglantz (trying to find a proper replacement, getting tired of all the broken pimples), viper is its slower, more controllable variant...

the combination was too slow for my setup, i think it needs a faster blade to reach its disturbance potential...on a slower blade i could put any ball where i wanted, but there was no extra spin reversal or wobble...

this was my initial impression, and i think my last

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My TT blog
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Thanks to forum member Matt Pimple, who loans me his uncut red OX sheet. Took the Dragon Talon off my blade and put the Viper on and did a 30 minute hit with my coach. The Viper is definitely slower than the Talon. I was able to keep most blocks on the table. Passive reversal is "very good" according to my coach who says he needs "considerable effort to loop back my blocks". The other good thing about this rubber is how easy it is to keep the ball low, whether blocking or pushing. I am confident to say this is a big improvement over the Desperado which has no reversals on passive blocks and balls tend to go higher. Visually from my point of view there is not much fluttering/wobbling with the Viper compared to the Talon. So I would not know how "disturbing" the Viper is until I play some matches.

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The Dark Side: "Quicker, easier, more seductive" - Yoda

I had a hit with the Viper OX today & found it to be similar but slower than the D-tecs with good spin reversal but because of the slower speed my practise partner had some difficulty with his returns. Using blocks & chop/blocks while returning top spin shots I found my return more often than not staying on the table also on the Re-Impact Smart I had great control, definitely worth further investigation.

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Setup 1: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS acid green OX BH
Setup 2: Setup 2: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango PS black 2.00mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS red OX BH
Setup 3: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Spinlord Gigant anti-spin red BH
See the ball, be the ball...

I have tried this pips, and my opinion is it is really suitable for active blocking, but the durability is not good, my coach use this pips for blocking on the backhand and I loop continuously, hard loops for about 30 minutes and the pips is broken, lost about 4 or 5 pips.

After playing 3 weeks with the Viper, I think I will be keeping this as my primary LP. The Viper plays like a better version of Dornenglanz. It blocks well, able to keep the ball short with good reversal; and it hits and have good placements on pushes (once you get used to its lower speed).

As compared to the Dragon Talon I was using, the passive reversal is very close. If the Viper has less reversal than the Talon, it is not by much and it definitely has more reversal than any other LP I've tried (except for grass dtecs). If I have time to make a chop block with the Viper, the ball is not coming back if my opponent tries to re-loop it. (keep in mind most of the players I play with and sub-1900). Talon (or grass dtecs) does not have the control of the Viper when it comes to pushing and hitting.

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The Dark Side: "Quicker, easier, more seductive" - Yoda

I now have the Viper OX on the BH of one of my blades & a D - Tecs on the BH of another both have great spin reversal. Both are quite similar with the Viper being much slower so I can change them which helps with deception my opponents seem to have some confusion because of this. Using blocks & chop/blocks while returning top spin shots I find my return more often than not staying on the table also I had great control. My backhand flick was working well with a lot of punch & accuracy, my Viper is working very well. I'm happy with both my set-ups.

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Setup 1: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS acid green OX BH
Setup 2: Setup 2: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango PS black 2.00mm FH & Tibhar Grass D.TecS red OX BH
Setup 3: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Spinlord Gigant anti-spin red BH
See the ball, be the ball...

I've had a few session with this rubbers now, and here my review.

You can find the full review of the Viper here, where I've add more details and pictures.

Here is the summary:

Test Setup
I decided to test the Viper (OX red) on my spare Re-Impact Smart blade, since this is the blade I normally use, and this allows me to do a good comparison to my usual long pimple rubber, the Tibhar Dtecs OX.
I used Donic formula first glue, which is what I usually use for OX sheets, as it’s very thin and spreads more evenly. As the Dr Nuebauer instruction recommended, I put a layer on both the blade and the glue sheet (after removing the backing), before applying it to the blade.
Despite the Viper sheet being so translucent, it did not appear to make the sheet look too dark.

Blocking against topspin: At low speed the ball grips a little on the pimples, producing a higher but slow ball that seems to be floating with little backspin. A chop block is required to keep these balls low, and this works very well, producing good backspin. Although some of the balls were a little high (when passive blocking), they seemed to move around quite a bit and not easy to attack, which is probably caused by the soft pimples that bend so easily.

At medium to high impact the trajectory drops quite a bit, producing a low & short balls with good backspin, as implied by the manufacturer’s description. The pimples absorb the speed very well, unless the impact was very high (which is hard to handle with any OX long pimple). This rubber is very effective for blocking (passive & chop blocks) and is really good for blocking to the angles.

Compared to Dtecs, Viper’s spin reversal is less but it’s considerably slower and takes the pace off much better. Similar to dtecs, it produces many awkward balls, adding an element of unpredictability to it that the dtecs is well known for.


Chopping away from the table: Against slower to medium pace loops, the soft pimples of the Viper allows you to really load up the backspin, produce very heavy backspin balls, even heavier than with Dtecs, which gave my opponent big troubles. As the pace picks up, you need to make sure your stroke is fast enough, aand you’ll continue to return very high backspin. The Viper takes the pace of much better than Dtecs, so you can swing hard and still land the ball on the table.

Chopping against topspin at mid to far distance produced very good backspin too. At high impact the Viper gave the bat a harder feel compared to the dtecs, and it produced a flatter (lower) trajectory, but I’m not sure if it produced quite as much backspin. Although I prefer the softer feel of the dtecs, I seemed to have no trouble controlling the Viper at all, and my opponent had just as much trouble lifting the balls.

I suspect the wider pimples of the dtecs provide more cushioning and less bending, giving it a softer feel, while the Viper pimples bend more, potentially producing more reversal at high impact.

Returning serves: The relatively slow but slightly grippy and soft pimples makes the Viper particularly versatile for returning serves.

Short serves can be returned very short and low with ease. A slight brushing action provides control in doing this. These serves can also easily be flicked, as the soft pimples and grip make it much easier to grip the ball. I found myself attacking short serves with relative ease, whether backspin, topspin or no-spin, and it’s certainly a lot easier than with Dtecs which has too little grip to attack topspin or no-spin consistency.


Against backspin: Waiting for a backspin ball so that one can attack with the pimples is a common strategy for long pimple players as it can produce such awkward balls that can be hard to attack.

Pushing aggressively with the Viper worked very well, producing decent reversal and a nice sinking ball. As with all long pimples, I expect the reversal to improve as the sheet is worn in a little.

Attacking (hitting) these balls with the Viper seemed even more effective, and the soft pimples add just a little grip, which makes it so much easier to attack backspin balls. I find that attacking with just a little side-swipe action is the most consistent way to attack with OX pimple, as the slight brushing action provides significantly more control in both depth and direction.


Conclusion
It’s really good to have another soft long pimple on the market, as most pimples seem to be medium or hard. Softer pimples tend to offer more unpredictability in the amount of spin it returns, and the Viper is no exception.

The Viper clearly excels close to the table, where is offers great versatility in returning serves, offers good reversal and braking effect against loops, and is effective at pushing or attacking against backspin. If you block loops off the bounce, you can easily get short balls with good angles and good spin reversal, this rubber excels at this.

Away from the table, the Viper allows good spin manipulation and very high backspin against slow to medium pace loops, and offers good spin reversal at high impact as the pimples bend completely.

I've used the rubbers in a few session now, including some games, so I've got a pretty good feel of it. The more I use it, the more I like it.

happy to answer any further questions

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OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide