OOAK Table Tennis Forum

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I'd say the answer is most certainly Yes, MNNB!

They do have a dilemma of how to control it, but they also have an obligation to do so given they made the rule. I think Greg's "back of the envelope" suggestion has some merit, but also quite a few flaws (which he admits may be present). The key thing as he says though, is there should be some thought and effort into enforcing their own rules on this issue as they have forced an unlevel playing field and an environment of forcing players to cheat or suffer the consequences. This makes them idiots in just about anyone's eyes surely?

The main flaw I see in Greg's plan is that there is no allowance for players to renew their rubbers on their bar-coded bats when they are taken away after a tournament for testing and then secure lock-away again. I'm sure no pro will want to leave the same rubbers on their bat for tournament after tournament. So they would need to have a way to return the bats to the players after post-match testing, and then let them apply new rubbers, be re-submitted for re-testing of new rubber speed and spin, and sent away again for lock-away again until the next tournament. This process would have to occur after every tournament assuming players would want fresh rubber for every tournament and if tournaments were close together, there may not be time for the whole process to occur.

Not only that, but I'd like to own the facilities for the secure lock-away of bats with an exit and entry fee for each 3 bat set for each player on the world's pro circuit (and lower level ones too). It would be a rather profitable business I think.

Perhaps if a machine to test the revs and speed a rubber produces could be made cheaply enough each tournament could have a secure bat locker (if each had a test unit), where all bats go after testing on entry to the tournament and only be released at the end of the tournament. It would require some pretty good organisation for checking bats in and out for play still though to ensure timing wasn't affected. And without a great control system you could see things happening like bats going missing or handed out to the wrong player, etc, as there would be a LOT of bats to be handed around in a short space of time. Human errors would be bound to creep in and cause potential chaos.

So while it is admirable for Greg to suggest something should be done, I don't think its quite as simple to devise a system that would make this all work as easily as he seems to think it is, even with some uber smart people involved. Even if every player and coach and umpire was super honest and didn't try to cheat the system in any way, the logistics of having bat control and management put into some central rigid control function would have inherent risks and problems associated with it in just having bats available in timely fashion for each match. As far as not being able to cheat the system, I suppose if the bat code were somehow easily put, automatically after the bat is chosen, on the match scoresheet opponents could check the player is using the correct one, as it would be in their interest. But I think without a computerised system in place to handle printing of a bat bar-codes onto the match sheet for the bats involved errors would still occur. And I wonder whether tournaments would have the organisation and dollars available to them to meet the needs of such a system? And if they did, would the elderly volunteers so many tourneys get, cope with operating the system?

Does anyone else want to contribute some thoughts on this? Is there a way to overcome these inherent problems? Is there another solution altogether that might work? I think its a really interesting discussion to have.

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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get rid of the ban alltogether. the association is tight enough with the money, and money is becoming more and more scarce. also if the ban is lifted it will be another way of making money( more product sold), boosters anyway, i would imagine they posses less harm ( where as i never found SG that bad in the first place nor do i see how its that bad anyway... as long as 4 year olds dont use them and such)..

then there is the personal preference, for me i prefer glued up sheets as they have more natural/fluid feel nothing to do with how much spin/ speed it provides..

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Just lower the overall rubber/sponge thickness to 3.5mm and let players and manufacturers tune with VOC-free products as much as they like. No one will be able to blast their opponent away at will with loopkills anymore.

Excellent article by Greg!

I would aslo think that just getting rid of the system is by far the simples and most effective... trouble is that by doing this, for some people in the ITTF would be like admitting they made a mistake...

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Writing these sort of ranting articles is always kind of fun, since I get to get things off my chest and have a go at suggesting a better way at the same time. Plus every now and then it provokes a bit of debate.

As Reb noted, there would be flaws/problems in my suggestion, but he's already improved it a little, and pointed out some potential problems that could be worked on.

As I said in the article - it's now 3 years after the initial ban, and the ITTF still haven't got a workable system. I don't think it's an impossible thing to do, so you have to ask yourself at some point, if they haven't got it right after 3 years, is it because they don't really want to?

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Perth Table Tennis Club

+1 for roundrobin's idea.

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The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
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My whole set-up costs less than a sheet of Butterfly Dignics

I don't quite see how reducing thickness would add to solving the problem. Wouldn't letting players tune with VOC-free products be enough? I see how reducing thickness would slow the loopkills, but would it level the field, or give more advantage to the player with more power in their body?




I thought it was a great article Greg. Lots of fun to read and respond to. I don't understand why the ITTF would introduce these rules and then ignore properly checking them. All they have done is put anxiety among the TT world and forced players to either cheat or be disadvantaged by being honest. Its downright irresponsible. I think the reason 3 years have gone by without a solution is because they thought Enez machines would do the trick, and never fully thought through prior to introducing the rules that VOC-free boosters would be developed. Nor did they consider anywhere outside of the "main" TT arena would afford or bother to get Enez machines or later revisions. I believe their only consideration is TT is Europe and maybe China. They appear to me to be a self-congratulating group who can see no wrong in their doings and as such how could they ever see any need to put anything right in this situation?

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.

I guess that depends on the degree to which you look at the game as an athletic contest.



Well - why go zero tolerance on the VOCs? It isn't a position that you can hold based on health and safety. Low levels, sure. Zero levels, now way.

You can only guess what's on their minds I suppose. My best guess is a combination of agendas that aren't quite what they say they are (I'm still trying to figure out the truth behind the claim of celluloid being banned. How can that be possible in a world that makes all kinds of nasty solvents and poisons?) and a moderate bit of incompetence in not thinking the rules all the way through as competitors are sure to do. I think there's a bit of arrogance tossed into the mix as well.

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Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
Hardbat: Nittaku Resist & Dr. Evil

I'm sure someone out, who may not know much about TT (eg IOC), equates tuning/boosting with doping, and therefore mandates that a zero-tolerance level is required.

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Blind eye? Nope. Hooking up the TT manufacturers, Maybe. Still, if jokers could get TT as a school sport, the explosion in sales of TT equipment would skyrocket on its own. Never underestimate the power of a sports mom who wants to equip their kids with an edge.

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There is no evidence of that. This is not stuff people are putting in or on their bodies. Table Tennis took a long road to the eventual ban. If there were outside pressure or significance, I'd have expected change to happen much faster. As it was, the pending ban was postponed at least once - maybe more.

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Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
Hardbat: Nittaku Resist & Dr. Evil

You're right in that there's no evidence, but the term "zero tolerance" is normally only used with reference to drugs and/or serious crimes, not with a harmless liquid that makes a ball move faster... so this makes me suspect this mandate originated from someone that did not really understand what tuners/booster are.

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OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide

The ITTF issued a document stating that VOC-free tuners "are generally bad for your health, even containing poison in some cases," so apparently baby oil is OK for babies but too toxic for table tennis use.

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The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
Table Tennis Video Links: itTV | laola1.tv | ttbl | fftt | Challenger Series | mnnb-tv

My whole set-up costs less than a sheet of Butterfly Dignics