OOAK Table Tennis Forum

I have not blogged in a long time. Since then I went on an EJ rampage to find what I like to play with. originally I wanted to learn to be a long pip chopper who looped fh like Chen Weixing. I was a two winged looper and I picked up a Chen blade and p1r slapped some tenergy 05 on it and I was ready to go. I played for about a year and won u1700 in my state championship for the first tournament unveiling my new setup. It was fun but I really didn't chop all that well.

In 2010 I played the US open and broke my Chen during a match and it led to a downward spiral of EJing defensive blades. Eventually it led to a defplay, but others came to my house and never left.

Then I got bored and played for a while with short pips on the backhand. The short pips I liked were 802 and most recently stiga clippa.
I got to the point where I was playing the exact same level with sp on the back as lp and as inverted both sides. So what did I do.
For a week I played sp and lp... I sucked but still beat 1600 players.... At that point I decided to play long pips as my main setup with inverted.

That's where I am now. I still have a short pip blade to help train buddies or for those who can't deal with the long pips.
I'm still honing my chop, but I've added several shots close to the table using my long pips.
At this point I realize I can play with anything. I've used fast blades with pips, slow blades with pips, slow and fast blades with inverted.
They all work for something...

Now I realize what I need to work on. EVERYTHING.
I need to make the shots that are weak strong. I need to work on every aspect of my game that is not a forehand loop so I can get my forehand loop into play and when I loop I need to attack and attack until I am forced to chop or block because of positioning.
I need to start working on my serves and return again and spend time getting to the point where this is the strong part of my game.

Most of all I need to finish school so I can play consistently. Currently I'm about 1 year away from earning a masters of science in nursing, and an MBA.

Otherwise I can't complain about my life. Everyone around me is amazing. family is everything I wanted it to be. So this is the start of new things for me. NEw blog, the end of an EJ, the beginning of understanding more about my game.

Videos to come sporadically throughout the year.

_________________
-Teddy

Welcome back Teddy

The Defplay with the 401 and p-1r should be an excellent combination for a chopper that want to attack as well. I love the rubber as it both chops and loops really well. I've decided to use this rubber for my season as well... hope I don't find a reason to change again.

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So I pretty much made a realization the other day. I am not getting younger. I'm going to be 34 this year which is relatively young but my physical fitness is lacking lately. Yesterday I slipped going for a forehand loop moving to my right. My right foot slipped on the floor to the right and my left leg stayed in place and my left knee took the impact while I hit the floor. The inside of my left knee is swollen. I bought some motrin and a knee brace. I got an xray at the 7 bed ER close by my house that night to confirm that I did not break anything. Luckily I could walk and it just hurts the inside of my left knee. I iced it and the brace really helps.

Findings from the training session. Chopping is fine but my backhand really lets me hit/counter topspin really well. It pushes and sideswipes backspin great. In this realization I find that I actually am more natural hitting/blocking and throwing in an occasional chop here and there rather than playing the modern defense game. I also twiddle well and have a decent inverted backhand so I will be looking to stay closer to the table as my main strategy from now on. If I wanna play around and chop I can, but I should be looking at Carl Prean, and Deng Yaping as a type of game to aspire to.

Note: I am not a slow person, but covering less ground and being more efficient with my movement will probably serve me well as I get older.

When I get a chance and My leg feels better I'll get some video up.

_________________
-Teddy

Thanks for posting your videos and blogging - you chop well, indeed, and I wholeheartedly agree about the efficiency of play and the economy of strokes....

Just a quick question. As a chopper, how do you deal with the initial phases of starting a rally with a looper who attacks early and won't open with a slower pace that you can chop? Do you chop-block or block a few of the initial attacks and hope the attacker slows down before moving into position behind the table?

Thanks.

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A big bag full of blades and long pimples, donuts and coffee!

Timeout- There are a few things I would do to combat this, but this kind of looper is the bread and butter of most choppers. This is the kind of player you want to play as a chopper because they will do exactly what you think they will do and that is loop or loopdrive.

On their serve it's tougher. Most likely these guys will serve long and fast to the backhand or the transition zone where you most likely will take it with your pips.... This is where they set you up and kill the ball as quick as possible to not let you get into the point.

Things you can do on his serve (I'm sure there are more)
1. Chop it and know that it's coming to your backhand and quickly move back to chop again (The easiest solution but if the guy is good your percentages will be rough)
2. Chop it to the elbow or softly to the wide forehand, or to the backhand each one will give options to the player that will target specific angles....
3. Twiddle and attack the serve. (I do this alot, but it's risky)
4. Chop then twiddle and block the shot with your inverted and that should give you a little time to get back to chop.
5. Take the serve with your forehand... An inverted return adds spin to the ball which gives you spin to work with and chop.

Things I do on my serve.
1. Serve short... These types of players love to flip. Especially the Banana flip. The flip is easy to chop and then drop back and wait for the loop to come.
2. Serve with lots of sidespin. Regardless if it's side top or side back the shot you hit with your pips will have reciprocal sidespin that makes the next shot you hit less predictable.
3. Serve fast to the backhand and challenge them to loop to your backhand knowing that you will be chopping.

These are a few things I do. There are better choppers out there who can answer your question better and more completely.
As far as me being slower it is becoming more evident, but lack of good training partners is also a problem. The majority of my club is under 1500. Every time I go there is an average of 5 to 7 players who are higher rated than me. This makes me choose what to train with each match. I will lose matches purposefully only working with one serve and forcing certain situations to happen over and over.

Hopefully this helps you Timeout. If you have great touch you can block with your pips but you have to be a freak of nature to have that kind of touch... Not to say it isn't possible.

_________________
-Teddy

Thank you for the quick and detailed response tabesamis!

Still re-reading your reply... lots of excellent pointers.

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction, your experience is invaluable to me as I struggle to improve my chopping game...

_________________
A big bag full of blades and long pimples, donuts and coffee!

Things you can do on his serve (I'm sure there are more)
1. Chop it and know that it's coming to your backhand and quickly move back to chop again (The easiest solution but if the guy is good your percentages will be rough)

>That’s the real problem I just realized…the better players serve faster, dictate a faster pace, as a result my returns are not good enough perhaps due to lack of concentration. The returns are probably too high and fast, just exactly what they want although I have seen quite amazing things from the high quality players eg 1800+ CAN in that they can loop lowly placed balls with lots of reversal backspin from my lps.

2. Chop it to the elbow or softly to the wide forehand, or to the backhand each one will give options to the player that will target specific angles....

>that’s interesting… tied into my returns’ again…gotta work on the directional control as well as simply just returning flat fast serves from max inverted rubbers… in my division I can easily return the lower-quality serves in a direction that I want…

3. Twiddle and attack the serve. (I do this alot, but it's risky)
>…risky for you, then no way for me since you got about 1k over me☺
4. Chop then twiddle and block the shot with your inverted and that should give you a little time to get back to chop.
>same as above
5. Take the serve with your forehand... An inverted return adds spin to the ball which gives you spin to work with and chop.
>This is where I would twiddle… still risky for me since I’m not good with inverted AND I probably would favour sponge lp on my fh…

Things I do on my serve.
1. Serve short... These types of players love to flip. Especially the Banana flip. The flip is easy to chop and then drop back and wait for the loop to come.
> great tip here that even I can do!!! muchas gracias!

2. Serve with lots of sidespin. Regardless if it's side top or side back the shot you hit with your pips will have reciprocal sidespin that makes the next shot you hit less predictable.
>ditto the above.

3. Serve fast to the backhand and challenge them to loop to your backhand knowing that you will be chopping.
>ditto again

As far as me being slower it is becoming more evident, but lack of good training partners is also a problem. The majority of my club is under 1500. Every time I go there is an average of 5 to 7 players who are higher rated than me. This makes me choose what to train with each match. I will lose matches purposefully only working with one serve and forcing certain situations to happen over and over.

>As far as athletics goes, I think it’s secondary to the tactics, playing style, and equipment (I guess)…there’s a guy here who’s 70ish with a can rating of 2600…when he was 50 he was a few hundred lower…that’s what I’ve been told…btw he plays PH with pips and stays close to the table…

Once again kind sir, thanks. You are a true ping pong scholar as well as a scholar of other endeavors… I’ve already improved just by typing this email (in typing that is☺

BTW you got a “cute” avatar…she must be a few years older now…

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A big bag full of blades and long pimples, donuts and coffee!

Thanks for your comments. Have you tried returning serve with inverted on the backhand? You don't need to backhand loop. Against the fast serve you could block or chop accordingly. Also if you learn to return serve with inverted it makes things easier for your pips to be effective.

As far as the 2600 ph player does he use long pips? Or short. Both can be successful but you have to have a good arsenal of shots regardless to get to that level including one or two shots that dominate. For example not everyone has to have a killer loop. Good loops are common but a great block that is like a brick wall can mess tons of people up.

Another example is pushblocker. His block vs loop is good but the pushblock vs backspin is possibly the best part of his game.

If you find a dominating shot in your game it makes it more likely that strategy will equal high rating. Also those people know how to avoid their weaknesses. I'm still not there yet.

Anyway just things to think about. Thanks for your kind thoughts an comments. Btw my avatar is 4 this month:)

_________________
-Teddy

Thanks for your comments. Have you tried returning serve with inverted on the backhand? You don't need to backhand loop. Against the fast serve you could block or chop accordingly. Also if you learn to return serve with inverted it makes things easier for your pips to be effective.

>I have 20 blades with various combinations of rubbers ha ha. Right now I’m on this LP/LP kick just for returning serves and for experimentation. I won my div this year again, second time in a row, but the results are not officially posted and I wont get my trophy until June, so it was a good experiment, kinda like what you do with the top guys in your club…I good with inverted for a rec player but vs 1500+ then???? More practice and more games are required, therefore more losses too☺

As far as the 2600 ph player does he use long pips? Or short. Both can be successful but you have to have a good arsenal of shots regardless to get to that level including one or two shots that dominate. For example not everyone has to have a killer loop. Good loops are common but a great block that is like a brick wall can mess tons of people up.
> The number 2 guy in my div told me that…he played with club two decades ago and went on leave at the turn of the century to raise his children and he’s back now so he knows all these old guys up here…its PH with inv FH and LP on back I assume, I’ll ask him again to confirm, but he told me that was a realistic goal as he aged and wanted to maintain a high standard…

Another example is pushblocker. His block vs loop is good but the pushblock vs backspin is possibly the best part of his game.

> I’m a big fan and already the guys at the club call me that but I also can play the chop game which works on the easy guys and that brings me here to seek your advice…

If you find a dominating shot in your game it makes it more likely that strategy will equal high rating. Also those people know how to avoid their weaknesses. I'm still not there yet.

>very modest of you to say this…

Anyway just things to think about. Thanks for your kind thoughts an comments. Btw my avatar is 4 this month:)

>my daughter just turned five and I got 10 years on you!!! So your doing really well!

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A big bag full of blades and long pimples, donuts and coffee!

So here's an update. After I jacked my knee up the other week it still is tender. It should heal fine but I've been wearing a knee brace at work and taking a motrin about once a day. It does seem to be getting better but when I bend my knees fully to squat the proximal side of my left knee hurts, It hurts only when my thigh is touching my calf and I have weight on it.

From reading though blogs I got inspired to find ways to combat this. The only way I see being effective is to develop a secondary game. So...

I'm working on pushblocking chops and pushes. Not sure if pushblocking or pushhitting is working for me better but I will find out. I tend to twiddle using my inverted on both sides to attack.

For this I set up a blade:

Cut down butterfly innershield zlf (vibrations have been cut down and the blade is faster than normal due to a more compact head).
FH: Victas >401 1.8
BH: Hellfire ox (This rubber is the easiest rubber I've tried to hit and push against backspin, not too fast, but easy to use)

This will be a fun experiment while I get better. I'm taking it easy as I can. Three days a week I work 12 hours on my feet so I wear a brace. Otherwise I will probably restrict heavy practice time at the club and go for quality rather than quantity. This means I have to think alot more about my approach to get better.

Wish me luck.

_________________
-Teddy

Update:

Just finished the US open. Because of time constraints I could only play one event U1800.
I came with the goal of getting out of my round robin, and playing in the knockout rounds.
Based on preparation of playing once every two weeks I found this to be achievable but difficult.

Before the tournament I had an incident with my pips which made me switch them the day of the tournament.
The closest pips they had to p1r was Joola octopus and since I've spent alot of time playing with thin sponge I chose 0.5
It strangely didn't affect me much. It played very similar and had a little more control for me.
I also was having issues with my forehand rubber being too slow with the victas koji matsushita so I had a sheet of Tenergy 05 that I mounted on it. I haven't used tenergy 05 for a couple years but it was like visiting an old friend. I had previously used tenergy 05 for a total of 5 years so I don't really know why I got away from it. In 1.9 it was very controllable and didn't lose me any points. I lost points for myself based on skill. Equipment felt great and the venue was fine and allowed me to move well. My knee fully healed and I was all set to go.

I played in my round robin. IT consisted of an 11 year old girl from california ICC club, which trained 2 of our young US Olympic girls. She was a very balanced player and was rated 1200ish, but played more like 1700 or 1800, an 11 year old boy from a big club in Washington with a female coach from China who played at a very high level and retired to coach in the US. The boy was rated 1455 and had a monster forehand as well as a solid backhand. The third player was a man rated 1655 who had previous rating of 1840 a few months ago, which makes me think he was sandbagging for the tournament.

The funny thing about this round robin was that two kids beat the second seeded guy fairly easily.
Playing the girl I won the first game close. She knew what to do against my pips, but I had serves that baffled her until her Chinese coach told her how to deal with them. The second game I demolished her using tricks. I twiddled and looped with long pips. Didn't twiddle and backhand looped for third ball winners, and chopped consistently enough for her to miss. The final game she couldn't make any adjustments that were considerable so I won 3-0.

The little boy played much more difficult. His forehand was very strong and he liked my pips as long as I was close to the table. When I chopped from far he missed both ways. I also chopped with inverted to make more variation and I was lucky to win the first game close. The second game he fell apart. I was up 10-0 and let a serve get by me to give him a point. He then won one more and I took the game with a third ball attack. The third game his coach gave him instruction and he came on strong. I fought hard and near the end of the game told myself that If I didn't put it away now I was in trouble. So I did. 3-0 me.

The last match I didn't have to win. Psychologically that was horrible. I was down 2-1. I had plenty of weapons that he couldn't deal with but I wasn't closing the deal. I was lucky to eek out the 4th game, and was struggling in the 5th. At 9-7 I realized he was fishing alot and though I was trying to exploit his week backhand his forehand wasn't as good as mine so I served topspin and short both times to open up the point and went cross court until he couldn't handle it. Had I played the match as a warmup going forehand to forehand as much as possible I would have won easily 3-0 but I won 3-2. Good thing. It prepared me for the knockout rounds.

The round of 32 was defaulted by my opponent....big bummer.

The round of 16 I played a little boy from ICC again. He had a coach with him and played very well against my pips. His forehand and backhand topspin were equal or better than mine and I wasn't winning much in terms of topspin exchanges. HE won the first game close. The second game I was determined to take more serves with my inverted side. This proved to be good. HE go both backspin and dead chops and he missed his opener more which allowed me to take the next two games. His coach made good adjustments and he became consistent in the fourth game and beat me. The fifth game was close. He got a good lead and when we switch courts I had to make a strategic change and brought it back to deuce. He won a long point twice and deserved to win. I lost close 3-2. He then went on to take out an 1844 player and lost to the second place finisher in the division.

OVerall I had a great tournament and learned two things I have to work on.

1. backspin vs my long pips. I need more practice against this.
2. twiddle coming back into the table and chop vs backspin using inverted.
3. return of serve with inverted more.

will continue to get better slowly.

_________________
-Teddy

Update:

Just finished the US open. Because of time constraints I could only play one event U1800.
I came with the goal of getting out of my round robin, and playing in the knockout rounds.
Based on preparation of playing once every two weeks I found this to be achievable but difficult.

Before the tournament I had an incident with my pips which made me switch them the day of the tournament.
The closest pips they had to p1r was Joola octopus and since I've spent alot of time playing with thin sponge I chose 0.5
It strangely didn't affect me much. It played very similar and had a little more control for me.
I also was having issues with my forehand rubber being too slow with the victas koji matsushita so I had a sheet of Tenergy 05 that I mounted on it. I haven't used tenergy 05 for a couple years but it was like visiting an old friend. I had previously used tenergy 05 for a total of 5 years so I don't really know why I got away from it. In 1.9 it was very controllable and didn't lose me any points. I lost points for myself based on skill. Equipment felt great and the venue was fine and allowed me to move well. My knee fully healed and I was all set to go.

I played in my round robin. IT consisted of an 11 year old girl from california ICC club, which trained 2 of our young US Olympic girls. She was a very balanced player and was rated 1200ish, but played more like 1700 or 1800, an 11 year old boy from a big club in Washington with a female coach from China who played at a very high level and retired to coach in the US. The boy was rated 1455 and had a monster forehand as well as a solid backhand. The third player was a man rated 1655 who had previous rating of 1840 a few months ago, which makes me think he was sandbagging for the tournament.

The funny thing about this round robin was that two kids beat the second seeded guy fairly easily.
Playing the girl I won the first game close. She knew what to do against my pips, but I had serves that baffled her until her Chinese coach told her how to deal with them. The second game I demolished her using tricks. I twiddled and looped with long pips. Didn't twiddle and backhand looped for third ball winners, and chopped consistently enough for her to miss. The final game she couldn't make any adjustments that were considerable so I won 3-0.

The little boy played much more difficult. His forehand was very strong and he liked my pips as long as I was close to the table. When I chopped from far he missed both ways. I also chopped with inverted to make more variation and I was lucky to win the first game close. The second game he fell apart. I was up 10-0 and let a serve get by me to give him a point. He then won one more and I took the game with a third ball attack. The third game his coach gave him instruction and he came on strong. I fought hard and near the end of the game told myself that If I didn't put it away now I was in trouble. So I did. 3-0 me.

The last match I didn't have to win. Psychologically that was horrible. I was down 2-1. I had plenty of weapons that he couldn't deal with but I wasn't closing the deal. I was lucky to eek out the 4th game, and was struggling in the 5th. At 9-7 I realized he was fishing alot and though I was trying to exploit his week backhand his forehand wasn't as good as mine so I served topspin and short both times to open up the point and went cross court until he couldn't handle it. Had I played the match as a warmup going forehand to forehand as much as possible I would have won easily 3-0 but I won 3-2. Good thing. It prepared me for the knockout rounds.

The round of 32 was defaulted by my opponent....big bummer.

The round of 16 I played a little boy from ICC again. He had a coach with him and played very well against my pips. His forehand and backhand topspin were equal or better than mine and I wasn't winning much in terms of topspin exchanges. HE won the first game close. The second game I was determined to take more serves with my inverted side. This proved to be good. HE go both backspin and dead chops and he missed his opener more which allowed me to take the next two games. His coach made good adjustments and he became consistent in the fourth game and beat me. The fifth game was close. He got a good lead and when we switch courts I had to make a strategic change and brought it back to deuce. He won a long point twice and deserved to win. I lost close 3-2. He then went on to take out an 1844 player and lost to the second place finisher in the division.

OVerall I had a great tournament and learned two things I have to work on.

1. backspin vs my long pips. I need more practice against this.
2. twiddle coming back into the table and chop vs backspin using inverted.
3. return of serve with inverted more.

will continue to get better slowly.

_________________
-Teddy

Update:
I haven't played in a long time but decided to sign up for a tournament for fun. After not playing long pips has been difficult mostly against no spin and heavy under spin serves so I tried something.

I found I was returning serve well with my inverted side so I just ordered a sheet of 401 in 1.5.
I can chop with my backhand decently with 2.0. So I figured I could at least block and loop a bit if I chose the 1.5. I also needed less weight on my blade.

It has been fun having less limitations on my backhand so for now I'm going to aim to play a double inverted modern defense game but in truth I'm more of an all rounder. More important I'm having fun. If you have any suggestions for a fh rubber that can loop well chop fine and is a little less weight let me know.

I tend to not like sponges softer than tenergy .
I'll try to find my camera one day if I get serious again. At this time I'm a few months from graduation and looking forward to adding 6 letters after my name.

_________________
-Teddy