OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Been thinking about this. My reasoning for not choing has been similar to Brett. It feels strange to cho and make a big deal about winning points when compared to the pros I'm no where near their level (and where losses and wins matter much more). Also, if I suddenly start performing poorly I'll be at a worse mental state because I was cheering myself on a bunch, giving me even more pressure. That said, I know how beneficial it can be. I sometimes play against a colombian guy who's mental game and focus is so good and he chos loudly and talks loudly between points. When I first met him, I actually thought "What's this guy doing? Why is he taking it so seriously at our level?" As I got to know him, my thinking changed and I believe he chos for himself, it does put opponents off as it did me at first. But I know that he's one of the most friendly guys ever and just loves to fight for every point, I can't dislike that attitude. I'm not a fan of choing, but I do need something to prevent negative body language and help me focus. I will try the suggestions mentioned. NL's points on meditation are super useful.

This is objectively true. It is not always subjectively true.

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Video LTT65 is basically my preparation whilst serving. I forgot I made the video https://ttedge.com/videos/ltt65-learnin ... ing-serves

I do a similar process whilst receiving.

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Thank you!

This discussion about cho'ing reminds me of an interview I watched with Feng Tianwei some years ago. Apparently, in her training sessions, her coach made her yell every time she scored a point. During practice. And if she forgot? Her coach fined her each time she forgot to yell. Sort of a reverse swear jar. She thought it was strange, so did the interviewer.

Iskandar

Thanks for the tip...you just directly made me money. I'm going to implement the same policy with players that I work with in the future. Then at the next major event, I'm going to make sure they train next to a highly respected tt leader like Samsonov. It will be hilarious. Imagine you were somehow training about 2 meters away from Samsonov. Would you really Cho after every training point you won? If so, would you really continue to Cho after he looked at you closely with a dirty look, head shake and shoulder shrug?

Feng is a great player. I've coached against her a few times for zero wins. I've seen her training a lot though I've never seen her choing after points in the hall. She either fired the coach or she owes a few million dollars.

Imagine you were the last human on earth and you found a tt robot to play matches against. The robot is just an arm with a racket and it has some good sensors to read spin and speed. It doesn't have a head and it looks nothing like a human. During your matches against Rusty The Robot, would you really stand there choing for your own sake everyday for 10 years? When you play video games by yourself at home, do you Cho loudly at regular intervals? Or is "Cho" something you just yell out at tt tournaments? Playing video games, you may very occasionally say "yes" if you beat a boss after 100 failed attempts. But then you'd realize that talking to yourself at home is somewhat questionable.

Though I imagine that some people would Cho to make tt friends laugh in clearly out of context situations. I imagine that NextLevel would Cho me if we went bowling, for example. I'd be surprised if he didn't now that I think about it. NextLevel knows that I understand the Cho and all the social context around it, and it would be hilarious. But I doubt that NextLevel would Cho his work colleagues if they went bowling. That wouldn't be so funny and he'd lose his job and perhaps his freedom.

If you played a badminton tournament, would you yell out Cho after winning a point or a game? My point is that the "Cho" is extremely socially contextual. I'm neither for or against it. If there was a button to push and all Chos would stop, I probably wouldn't push the button, so that means I'm slightly for it...I guess.

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I think you should do what you are comfortable doing. Lin Yun Ju is comfortable shutting up. Harimoto is comfortable screaming in the middle of the court and creating a scene. Most are obviously somewhere between these 2 extremes.

In my experience, tt players are less comfortable Choing as they get older. In 10 years time, I doubt that Harimoto will be doing exactly what he does today. Once his prefrontal lobe is fully online at around the age of 25, he'll be forced to back off. It will probably look something more like Ma Long. Ma Long let's you know that he's there, but it's not an ongoing talking point.

The thing that worries me is some coaches see louder Choing as a positive and, from time to time, demand it from their players. I've seen situations where the coach believes their player isn't trying hard enough just because he/she isn't loud enough. I kind of understand how this has all gone down over the last 10 years. Some young loud players have enjoyed outrageous success and, to the naked eye, it really appears that being loud is a contributing factor.

We need Waldner back to balance the scales. Being calm was once cool.

Indian players have gotten a lot louder over the last 10 years. I never mentioned it to anyone when I was there. I didn't try to change a player in relation to all of this.

My point is, you should do what you are comfortable doing. For the second time, never let my posts put you on or off Choing. Sometimes I just post for my own record.

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This is a link to me doing a subtly difficult forehand drill https://photos.app.goo.gl/SqAy4iRavgeLyvgR7

The feeder is always changing the speed and spin of the balls. I'm trying to wait to start my backswing which is easier said than done, making this one of my favorite drills. I'm also using a variable length backswing that mainly relates to the speed of the oncoming ball . I'm doing some other stuff too. I should make a video about this on the website.

So please...go ahead...tell me everything you believe I'm doing wrong.

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Taking a break to walk away and chop a ball into the catcher after your feeder missed the table twice in a row is hilarious. Let him think about the error of his ways. LOL

Not to say it is wrong, but it is interesting to see how Mizutaniesque your form can be when playing countertopspin close to the table. That gives a better idea of the range of your technique.

And it does look like a great drill for timing. It appears to be easier/more consistent for you when the ball comes in faster than when you have slightly more time. Perhaps you are also going for more on the slower balls so that's not a fair comparison, but it looked that way just running through it once.

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Smile in the mirror. Do that every morning and you'll start to see a big difference in your life.

Yoko Ono

I have done the above drill with Brett, I can say it is much harder to do than Brett makes it look, having to wait before you start your backswing on a slow ball after a few fast ones was very difficult for me.
It is good to see that on a few even Brett seems to start his swing a bit too early, hence one of the walk aways, I think to try to reset.
Brett you seemed to miss a few of the down the line ones long, perhaps needs more emphasis on the topspin than pace for that direction. Go for the, they will block it off due to the amount of topspin on rather than can't reach it due the pace.

Choing, no way am I doing that during practice.

I think choing can be a double edged sword, if players cho a lot, sure it might boost them during the match but if they get on short run of loosing points it becomes silent and then there is no doubt who is now winning and a huge boost for the non choer. I think not choing makes it easier for me to focus on each point at a time rather than being distracted by a roller coaster of choing. Only time I will make some noise is occasionally at the end of a tight match where that duration is very short, where the boost from a shout may help me and hinder my opponent.

Brett is an excellent coach, has never missed two ball feeds in a row

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You're not choing lol

Actually, what I've been trying to do is figure out the difference between your crosscourt drive (ball ends up on the right) and your down-the-line drive (ball ends up on the left). Difference in elbow position with respect to the body? Wrist? Follow-through direction? Blade angle? Will watch a few dozen more times..

Iskandar

You asked for feedback so here is my take. Please let me know if the following is on the right track.

Nice crack sound on ball contact.

Maybe on a few shots your left leg comes forward a lot and it would be more difficult to move to the left if they can block or counter loop the ball back there. Assuming they could get a bat on the ball? I know you have criticized my own forehand for this habit in training now and then.

Perhaps in a few shots you end up with too much weight on the right leg, again making movement after the shot harder?

A question.

If you have a slower ball, would it not be more effective to have more rotation rather than a longer backswing assuming you are delaying the backswing as much as possible? Would this not make the whip action more effective? I imagine this would be just as hard to train for as delaying the backswing .

LOL, I take breaks because I can't breathe. I've never been able to hit many balls without getting tired really fast. Not everyone can train for 8 hours straight! I kid myself by saying that it's because I put everything into each shot.

I believe that Boll uses the best technique for countering fast balls when he's ultra close to the table. Mizutani and I are just poor copies.

The slower ball is really hard to time after the fast ones. It's tempting to swing too early even though the key is to hold the backswing for as long as possible.

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Sometimes the aim can be to hit the ball for a clean winner, especially against a slow block. But against backspin, the goal should often be to make the opponent hit the ball off the end of the table. Visualize your opponent blocking your loop off the end of the table. Do it for 9 hours a day until you believe. Do it 12 times before every point. We must break down the resistance! Your imagination has the potential to change your reality!!!

If you want to start linking your training to match play, you've gotta start Choing after every successful point in training. Let's start at 9:30am on Saturday morning and see what happens. Did you just admit to trying to hinder your opponents with the Cho?

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